Identification: Tree Needs appropriate site ID Urgent

Hello all;
we would appreciate any help possible in identifying this tree. We've been offered a chance to move it, and would like it in a white garden we're working on (lovely white bark and a very graceful shape). However we don't know what it is or what its needs (site, sun, water etc) may be, or if it may have some feature (non white flowers for example) that might mean it is not suitable for that location. We only have a couple of days to get its new site ready as we have to pick it up on Wednesday night and have been unable to ID at this point. Any help at all would be appreciated.
Thank-you;
Nick
BriarMoon Farm
PS. also interested in suggestions for white/silver blooming/leaved shade tolerant climbers or vines

 

Maybe a Honey Locust? In any case, it's one of the trees from the huge family Fabaceae; I have yet to meet one that doesn't like full sun, but I've also met a fair few that do well in shade.

For shade-tolerant climbers in your area, I'd be looking at the variegated hardy Kiwi (I forget the cultivar name at the moment), as well as the pale to white rambling roses and white clematis.

 

Hi lorax;
thank-you for that. It does seem it must be some form of cultivar of Gleditsia. Though we have not been able to find any that specify white bark. I wish we knew more about the colour of flowers it might have to know what site to put it in. Also if we need to be concerned about poisonous foliage (pets, children, livestock etc.). You've got us on the right track I think! Any more input appreciated.
Nick
BriarMoon Farm

 

Not toxic to children or wildlife, and if I recall correctly the flowers should be a sort of very pale yellow to true white. However, I was thinking a cultivar of Robinia pseudoacacia (which has the white bark and fewer thorns) more than Gleditsia, although both are possible in your area. The former is much showier in bloom than the latter (which has inconspicuous green flowers).

 

The structure is a pretty good indicator of Gleditsia triacanthos. Robinia has a pronounced upright vase form typically and classically produces narrow angle unions.

Transplant could be tricky as the root system on this species is quite aggressive -- I wouldn't feel confident as far as how it will respond if it has had time to establish at its current site. Gleditsia does well in full and partial sun -- it's a very popular street and parking lot tree due to its tough tolerance to urban conditions.

Good luck!

 

Thank you very much to both lorax and ryansenechal. I think for sure it is one of those. I wish I could know which, as it seems the one is poisonous and the other is not, and the one has plentiful white flowers and the other does not...these factors both influence placement quite a bit for us. Also unsure as to size at maturity without knowing more. At least it seems that both favour similar conditions; lots of sunlight, alkaline soil (oh boy, here comes the lime... we have very acid soil).
From what I understand, there are no apparent thorns, the bark is white and "birch-like" and it is currently about 12 feet tall. To me, the shape looks sort of elm-like, feather duster-y but maybe a little wider and more weeping. Do these factors help us any?
Thanks again!
Nick
BriarMoon Farm

 

My vote goes to Gleditsia triacanthos. Common name honey locust.
This link may help. Pic on the left shows just one compound pinnate or bipinnate leaf.
Have a look at the very tips.
They all finish with a pair of leaflets. ( No single, odd leaf at the very end)
I believe looking at your pics this is what I am seeing.

http://www.ces.ncsu.edu/depts/hort/consumer/fourh/images/Gledits3.htm

http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgu...ndsp=25&ved=1t:429,r:22,s:51&biw=1243&bih=528

Compare this to images of Robinia pseudoacacia. Common name Black locust.
Also pinnate leaves. This usually has a single, odd leaflet at the end.

http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgu...8S_AQ&esq=1&page=1&ndsp=21&ved=1t:429,r:3,s:0

http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgu...6yyAQ&esq=1&page=1&ndsp=24&ved=1t:429,r:0,s:0



http://www.google.co.uk/imgres?imgu...HAAQ&esq=1&page=1&ndsp=24&ved=1t:429,r:11,s:0

 

Hello Silver Surfer;

Yes, you are right! In comparing the leaves it seems it realy must be Gleditsia triacanthos. So, does this mean no mounds of glowing white flowers for our white garden? Also, so far the references seem to say growth up to 100 ft! I think we may have just changed the site; though with a little more consideration, maybe either Gleditsia or Robinia may have been too big... Thank you Silver Surfer for this timely and conclusive clue! Well, if it's not got the lovely flowers, that is a disappointment, but the fact that it's not poisonous is a plus, and it still is a beautiful graceful looking tree that should be worth the digging.... hope the transplant goes well.

Anyone have any other suggestions for a suitable tree for our white garden? We've wondered about some form of weeping birch but then again, something with loads of white flowers is appealing. Something with a limited height might be a plan too; it's a small walled garden close to the house and we do get some fairly substantial winds as we are close to the sea.

Thank you everyone for the interest and input!
Nick
BriarMoon Farm

 

Cornus nuttalli 'Eddie's White Wonder' could have potential, although it is prone to spotting and defoliation as a result of Anthracnose depending on the amount of rainfall after leaf out.

 

Hi ryansenechal (Ryan?);
Yes, we would love a dogwood. However, we have one elsewhere on the property (don't know the variety) and we are struggling with what we believe may be Anthracnose... so until we figure out if we can help it, we won't plant another.
Actually, we have been meaning to post about it and see if anyone has advice for us... it is planted as a memorial to a much loved family member, so we have been very concerned about its condition. As newbies to the forum, are we best to make a seperate post, or ask away?
Thanks;
Nick

 

have you considered planting a Davidia involucrata or Dove Tree. They have beautiful white bracts that would enhance your white theme.

Also, it looks to me that there twine growing into the bark of that Gleditsia tree. Perhaps you could suggest that it be cut of simply cut it yourself. I know of trees that broke at the point where bark/tree had grown over an old rope. Fortunately no one was hurt and nothing was damaged.

 

Another very appealing smaller tree with attractive and fragrant white flowers and paler bark is Elderberry (Sambucus spp.)

 

Might be a bit large for the space -- the ones here at the Garden and the one along Southwest Marine Drive are about 12m/40ft high, with spread of about 10m/33ft.

 

Hi All;
thanks for the input and suggestions. Does anyone have experience with Styrax japonicus (Japanese Snowbell)?
I've been snooping about and came across this and wondered about 'Angyo Dwarf' or 'Carillon'/'Carilon'. They look beautiful but I've found limited info and don't know of a source.
Thanks;
Nick
BriarMoon Farm
Ps. We'll be moving the Gleditsia today; wish us luck!

 

A Davidia I spotted in Snohomish, WA was determined to have an average crown spread of 52' during 1988. Arthur Lee Jacobson reports in TREES OF SEATTLE - SECOND EDITION (2006) that "It has reached 82' x 7 1/2' in England and does best in part shade". He lists one for a private address in Seattle that measured 52 1/2' tall.

 

Yes, we noticed that too. We'll be removing that today. thanks;
Nick
BriarMoon Farm