Help ME! my JM's look terrible, are they dying?

Discussion in 'Maples' started by hondajustin, Sep 3, 2006.

  1. hondajustin

    hondajustin Member

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    Help ME! Are my JM Dying? Please advise...

    I have had a terrible time with my trees. I have been in this location for 1 1/2 years most of the trees that I am having problems with are my japanese maples, and my aspens. Not sure if it is over/under watering, bugs,fertilizer, or fungus. Maples look like watering issue and aspen looks like fungus. Both seem to atract the bees but I do not see many other insects besides the bees. Most of the trees are either 1 year or 4 months old. I have problems with 6 different trees. Is there any thing I can do for them I have to much money invested in these to loose them Here are some pictures any help and advise would be greatly apprecited.
     

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  2. mjh1676

    mjh1676 Active Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    Something to me says that your maples are suffering from some overwatering and maybe some fertilizer burn. They typically don't make good lawn trees or trees very near a lawn or in an area that receives run off from the lawn as they have very different needs than your lush looking lawn. Usually you cannot have a beautiful lush lawn and have the maple planted in it look good.

    Young or newly planted maples need good drainage, but can handle more mositure with age. Still they prefer not be in a very moist situation or standing water. Secondly the roots are very sensitive and will suffer quickly from excessive salt build up from fertilizers that will cause a root burn..

    In your favor is some new regrowth at the ends of many of the branches which is often a good sign. It could simple be some shock from the planting or the need to further adapt to you planting situation--although adaptation is slow and generally not the answer to incorrect culture.

    I would evaluate the conditions of cuture you have created for the maples. If it appears wrong then you will need to change it or move the maples. You might consider digging down into the surrounding soil to see how wet it really is. If it is saying very wet you can move or raise the trees onto mounds that may help. Even if you fix the drainage problem you will still have to consider the amount of nitrogen your lawn needs will be FAR in excess of what the trees need.

    If the site is not too wet then you probably can leave them and see what happens in the spring. I would bet things look a lot better. Then all you have to deal with is the nutrient issues.

    In answer to your question--are they dying? Maybe, but there don't appear to be any visible signs of death yet, just a lot of stress. Stress will eventually equate to death in most cases if the stress is severe and persistent.

    Regards,
     
  3. Rima

    Rima Active Member

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    Japanese maples don't do well in full sun at all, never have (though 'Bloodgood' works better than the lacier varieties). But what's going on with your other trees...? That would depend on soil, watering, etc. and you haven't given much info. there.
     
  4. Michael F

    Michael F Paragon of Plants Forums Moderator 10 Years

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    What little can be seen of the background looks very bleak growing conditions for Japanese Maples - they are woodland trees, growing in cool, sheltered, moist, shady conditions. Almost the exact opposite of what you have.
     
  5. mjh1676

    mjh1676 Active Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    Many Japanese maple can be grown in nearly full sun, but will often show some leaf damage. Often the damaged leaves are replaced by new growth later in the season as you are seeing now. If given good culture many maples, including the types you have planted, will grow just fine in heavy sun exposure and each year will likely do better for you.

    When growing Japanese maples in heavy exposure you need to be mindful of the culture and plant them in as good a situation as possible. The sun will be a minor stress for them as will a wet planting site, too much fertilizer, disease, hot wind, etc. You need to minimize the stresses when possible, but do not hesitate to put your trees in exposure. A little leaf burn is no big deal. What you have after a year in the ground with some of your trees appears to be more of a problem than just sun.

    If we all had woodland environments or cool shaded locales then our maples would always look good. The trade off is that in a warmer climate we get to see more colors and can get more overall growth than in a cool shaded environment. I will always strongly disagree with the idea that maples don't do well in full sun at all. A little leaf burn does not mean the plant is doing poorly and as I sated above there can be other benefits to having more sun on our plants. In many areas and with many maples, the plants will not suffer any noticeable damage from full or near full sun.

    Regards,
     
  6. hondajustin

    hondajustin Member

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    This is where the first jm is located in my yard. I have it planted in a mound for better drainage, and only run the sprinklers 1-3 times a week depending on the temp. The water doesnt touch the foilage when it runs. I water for about 5-10 min. Southern exposure tree with house on north side.
     

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  7. hondajustin

    hondajustin Member

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    The two bloodgoods pictured here were planted last year in mounds, with drips running to all which run 1-3 times a week for 5-7 min depending on temp. We have had some hot days this summer. They are northern exposure trees. The jm in the last picture on the right has lost most of its leaves, but the one one the left is doing just fine.
     

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  8. mjh1676

    mjh1676 Active Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    Thanks for the new photos. I really don't see much of an issue from the photos. The full exposure combined with reflected heat from the surrounding rocks, sidewalk, driveway, street, etc. are probably causing the foliage burn. This will likely be a fact of life with the way you have things planted if there are no other underlying issues. The will hopefully do better with time.

    I would wrap or paint the lower trunks of the maples that are getting the most reflected heat to prevent bark damage and scald. you will probably just have to look forward to spring and summer and deal with some or a lot of leaf burn in summer. Again, hopefully it gets better over time.

    Regards
     
  9. Rima

    Rima Active Member

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    As far as watering goes, 5 mins 3 times a week will only feed the grass and not even come close to what a tree needs! Try half an hour twice a week (less often but more of it) and you'll see a big difference. Oh, MJH - 'A little leafburn is no bigdeal"? To whom? If my tree's leaves were burned and crispy it would be a very big deal to me, and eventually could stress the tree into more than just looking bad. Japanese maples do not like the sun and while a few can survive it, the majority need light shade.
     
  10. Mark099

    Mark099 Member

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    I have a blood maple, which is grown in full sun. It gets run off from the grass fertilizers. It has done very well from day one. We have only had 1-2 day(s) of rain in the last month so it will get about 2-3 hours of water a week via the hose and sprinkler.

    Because of the hot/dry conditions this year a lot of the trees in the neighborhood are starting to lose their leaves or turn into autumn colouring. Our trees get regular watering and have done very well.
     
  11. mjh1676

    mjh1676 Active Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    In an ideal world sure, and even at that, to say they do not like sun is a terrible misnomer. They do just fine in sun and there are more than a few that do well. We can give maples direct sun up to mid-afternoon or even all day in many areas and they will show little to no leaf burn. Some will require shade in the hottest part of the day and others will want protection from hot wind. Much also depends on where the maple has come from and to what culture and climate it is adapeted to.

    Lets say I grow a seelding rootstock here in the hot valley for two years and then graft to it from a plant grown in full exposure in the same locale. I give it some shade until the graft heals up and for a few months there after and then back into mostly full exposure. I grow it for a few years and then send it to you in Eastern Canada where we can assume the light intensity is less as is the overall temperature or average temperature. You also have a shorter growing season. That tree will do fine for you in the full sun provided I did not send you more tender variegate which will want some late afternoon shelter most anywhere.

    A clean maple stressed by some leaf damage will bounce back once the temperatures subside and the extended growing season will allow for a new flush of growth to revive the tree and still provide plenty of time for the new growth to harden off. Of course we need to protect the trunks from scald and reflected heat, but the upper branches and twigs will do fine for the most part. Heck, I have grown most of my potted plants in black nursery pots on either a concrete slab or on black/brown weed barrier all summer--drip irrigated daily to every other day. Sure we have leaf burn, but the trees are fine--those with some diesease in them do struggle more than others, but I figure I get to find out early which plants are good and which ones will pull through for me if I want to push the envelope.

    Additionally, it is usually only the first set of leaves that burns for us here and if you look at the summer temperatures for Medford, Oregon and then imagine how I have been growing many of the maples it will prove that they can do just fine in heavy exposure. I have and Azuma murasaki that was one grown on the concrete slab and it was completely defoliated, but now it entirely covered with new leaves and is still in the same location. The new leaves are not burning at all and look very healthy. It is just a fact of life that the first set of leaves on most all maples will be more sensitive to the sun and heat. Getting plants in the ground helps a great deal as the plant can begin to acclimate--additionaly people buying plants that have originated in their own or hotter locales will make a better performing plant.

    The process of the tree pushing a second or third set of leaves and a second flush of growth is simply a response to our climate and an extended growing season. In this sort of situation we can have a healthy maple experience some or a lot of leaf damage and not think twice as it will come back just fine, likely the same year. In your case, with a short growing season, losing foliage has a much greater impact because you may not see as much regrowth. So in that sense there is a context. Subequently, we want to guard against leaf loss in any locale too late in the season or the loss of a second or third set of leaves becuase there is a good chance no buds will be set for the following year. When this happens we risk wood loss.

    So anyway, I don't see any reason for people to try to baby maples as most will do just fine in greater exposure than they are given credit for. They will also adapat over time and in a given season as Mark points out based on changes in climate and culture. I need all the room I can to plant maples, so I will use the sunny area that dominate the property as well as the limited shady spaces--I have to save those for the most tender plants. Since very few of us have the ideal and will want to plant maples regardless it is helpful to know what it possible when the ideal is not readily available--a temperate woodland environment with a good amount of filtered sun and consistent moisture in beds of forest humus would of course be the ideal and no one will argue that.

    As a reference, I have had or have these maples in the ground in full exposure: Bloodgood, Red Select, Crimson Queen, Vriidis, Trompenburg, Tennyo no hoshi, Beni schichihenge, Fireglow, Emperor I, Hogyoku, Orangeola, circinatum (species), Seiryu, Atrolineare, Kiyohime, Raraflora, Hupps Dwarf, Ezo nishiki, Ruby Ridge, Aratama, Yuri hime, Kawaii.
    Oregon Butterfly, Aka shigitatsu sawa, and Sister Ghost are close by in the ground with a good deal of filtered sun and Butterfly getting the most since it can handle almost full sun.
     
  12. Rima

    Rima Active Member

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    But not everyone lives in Oregon... here in the east, we defoliate (for smaller new growth) maple bonsai in early summer to be sure the new leaf crop will harden off by fall, and can't depend on a fall crop to harden in time for sometimes freezing late Oct. overnites. And I said Bloodgood is better in the sun that others (particularly the laciest ones), and because you've been lucky and are in a great climate, doesn't mean everyone else will have that luck.
     
  13. hondajustin

    hondajustin Member

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    I would wrap or paint the lower trunks of the maples that are getting the most reflected heat to prevent bark damage and scald.
    Regards[/QUOTE]

    Thank you for all your information I was starting to stress about all my leaf burn. What do you wrap or paint the lower trunks with?
     
  14. mjh1676

    mjh1676 Active Member Maple Society 10 Years

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    For the most part, a white latex paint applied in a couple of coats will do fine and reapplied as it begins to wear off and the tree grows. If you don't like that look they make any number of trunk wraps and trunk shields that will work. Just make sure they are loose enough or breathe well enough as not to trap moisture behind them.

    Good Luck,
    Michael
     
  15. seal

    seal Member

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    Just to be sure, you should send a small sample off to be tested by a plant lab. Here in Virginia there are two really bad diseases which can harm your maples. One is verticillium and the other is anthracnose. I can't say for sure by your photos, but its definitely worth the $20 or so to have that piece of mind. It looks a little like anthracnose but I am not a pathologist. Good luck. polly
     

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