Meyer Lemon Yellow & Brown Spots

Discussion in 'Citrus' started by lawreneb, Jan 3, 2008.

  1. lawreneb

    lawreneb Member

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    I have read a lot of the posts, but am still confused about the state of my plant. I have attached pictures that might help with the diagnosis. It has yellow spots on the top of the leaves (not all of them, but the ones closer to the top of the plant) and tiny brown spots underneath those same leaves. I have never grown anything so am very new to this.

    Plant Environment:
    * indoor plant (I live in very cold Rhode Island)
    * relatively small when I got it at about 1.5ft tall, no idea about age (have not seen flowers or lemons since I have had it. I bought it in September of 2007)
    * terra cotta planter about 16 to 18 inches in diameter
    * house temp kept at 65 - 70 degrees
    * plant is by a partially closed floor air duct & a non insulated window (but it doesnt leak air and the wall under the window seems relatively warm
    * florescent bulb left on over the plant for roughly 8 hours a day (it only gets a small amount of actual sunlight from the window)
    * we water the plant infrequently and mist its leaves daily
    * the root base seems shallow as I can pull the plant partially out of the pot very easily (but I didn't yank it and it seems to have some longer roots as well that are anchoring it)
    * the roots that I can see that are close to the top are light tan and do not appear to be rotten
    * this past week I did a deep watering that left some water in the pot saucer overnight (just read that was bad so I removed the excess water from the tray)
    * no webs from spiders are present
    * have never fertilized

    Any thoughts? Any help would be greatly appreciated!!

    Thanks,
    Emily

    Here is the link to my web album of the tree if those pictures dont work:

    http://picasaweb.google.com/emily.barnwell/LemonTree
     

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  2. Junglekeeper

    Junglekeeper Esteemed Contributor 10 Years

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    I don't have an explanation for the spotty leaves but you may have some soft brown scale on your plant. There appears to be a number of them in the first picture, particularly along the stem and the underside of leaves. Scale can be treated with insecticidal soap.

    Citrus trees should be fed with a high-nitrogen fertilizer once a month while they are actively growing. A 5-1-3 NPK ratio is thought to be optimal. Some growers, myself included, use a 30-10-10 formulation. Use one that has micronutrients included in the mix.
     
  3. lawreneb

    lawreneb Member

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    That is very helpful! What is the best kind of insectible soap and fertilizer to buy? I think the yellow spots could be a result of my recent overwatering (oops!); what do you think? Again, thanks for you help. - Emily
     
  4. Junglekeeper

    Junglekeeper Esteemed Contributor 10 Years

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    There are many brands of these products and I wouldn't presume to know which are the best. Having said that, Safer's brand of insecticidal soap is commonly available in my area. BTW, the adult scale (the ones you can see) should be physically removed before treatment with the soap. As for the fertilizer, choose one from those that are available locally that is water soluble keeping in mind what was suggested upthread.
     
  5. lawreneb

    lawreneb Member

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    Thanks for your help!
     
  6. skeeterbug

    skeeterbug Active Member

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    A tablespoon of dishwashing liquid per gallon will work about as well as insecticidal soap. Soap kills by drowning as it wets the waxy coating of insects. As for fertilizer for container citrus, I like the slow release fertilizers (with trace elements) like Osmocote and Dynamite --that way you only have to fertilize a couple times a yr. Just make sure you apply based on the size of the container, not the size of the treee.

    Skeet
     
  7. lawreneb

    lawreneb Member

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    Thanks for the trick! Any thoughts on the yellow spots?
     
  8. skeeterbug

    skeeterbug Active Member

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    Yellow spots like that can be from several things. It can be slight mineral deficiencies, in that case the trace mineral in fertilizers will eventually eliminate them. The spots can also be caused by insect damage.
     
  9. lawreneb

    lawreneb Member

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    Thanks for the help. I have some different fertilizers coming inthe mail - a citrus fertilizer and some trace minerals. I will also take your advice on the insectisidal soap. Thanks again.
     
  10. lawreneb

    lawreneb Member

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    So if you are still viewing this thread, I just received some plant food in the mail. I have an Alaska Fish Fertilizer at 5-1-1 nitrogen - phosphate - potash. It is in a liquid form. Then I also got some trace minerals - selenium, vanadium, bizmuth, chronium, iron and calcium. It is in a powder form. How do I apply these to the plant?

    Thanks!! Emily
     
  11. skeeterbug

    skeeterbug Active Member

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    I am not familiar with the trace mineral mix you have. Those minerals (most of them) are not usually in the trace element mix for plants that I am aware of. The elements you need are Iron, Magnesiun, Zinc, Boron, Copper, Manganese. There is a product called STEM (soluble trace element mix) by Peters but it only come in large bags (like 25#). Sometimes you can find it in smaller quantities on Ebay. I buy a similar mix called Essential Element Mix at a local hardware store in 5# bags.

    The fertilizer you have is a little short on Potassium. I can only suggest that you follow the directions on the container as I am not familiar with it. I would look for a slow release fertilizer like Osmocote or Dynamite with trace elements.

    Skeet
     
  12. squirrelmaniac

    squirrelmaniac Active Member

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    I know exactly what those spots are. They are my #1 adversary, as it has nearly claimed one of my dearly beloved lemons. Do this, and FAST: (Its a fungus, and spreads like wildfire) you need to buy a copper-based foliar insecticide, and spray the tree either outdoors, or in the basement as the stuff definitely stains things blue. the brand i used was Bonide liquid copper. Your plant is suffering from "citrus greasy spot"
    All leaves that are currently infected will eventually turn yellow and fall, probably in about 6-8 months or so. The biggest cause of this fungus is prolonged moisture on the top of the soil, which allows the spores to develop, then float their way up and onto the leaves. The interesting thing is that the fungus particularly likes larger chunky material in the soil to grow on, such as coconut husk, or pine bark, commonly used in citrus soils. I have found that it is helpful to use a very thin layer of fine sand on the top of the soil, which prevents the growth of the fungus. Anyway, good luck and remember to act ASAP to limit your inevitable loss of leaves, if they arent all infected already :/
     
    Last edited: Jan 28, 2008
  13. lawreneb

    lawreneb Member

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    I will try and find the Bonide liquid copper you are refering to...in the meantime here are more pictures. I will note that some leaves have fallen off the plant still green... Any thoughts on this before I get that copper stuff? Thanks so much!!
     

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  14. skeeterbug

    skeeterbug Active Member

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    The yellow leaf in the picture looks like an older leaf that the tree is going to shed-- that is normal--leaves only stay on the tree for about 1 1/2 yrs.

    The green leaf in the pot looks like it was shed while the petiole remains attached to the limb--that is a sign of stress.

    As for the other spots on the leaf-- I am not sure what is causing that.
     
  15. Junglekeeper

    Junglekeeper Esteemed Contributor 10 Years

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    There may still be some scale on the tree:
    Pic #1: On the mid-vein of leaf halfway along the top edge of the image.
    Pic #3: On the stem just below the thorn.​
     
  16. squirrelmaniac

    squirrelmaniac Active Member

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    Ok, those pics are much clearer. I'd say it's not greasy spot, however copper based fungicides are a great "cover all" treatment, so i'd use it anyway- it definitely looks like something was munching that leaf!
     
  17. lawreneb

    lawreneb Member

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    How do I get rid of scale? My lemon tree is making me so sad. Its 66 degrees by the pot...is that too cold? I also have a humidifier right next to it. would it be a good idea to wrap the pot in christmas tree lights to warm the pot?
     
  18. skeeterbug

    skeeterbug Active Member

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    If it is 66 by the pot it is probably several degrees cooler in the pot. If you are exposing the tree to direct sunlight, then you really need to warm the roots, but if you warm the roots, you also need to provide some additional light. If is is not exposed to direct sun or intense artificial light, it will do fine at the current temp and will just rest until warm weather returns.

    Skeet
     
  19. squirrelmaniac

    squirrelmaniac Active Member

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    To get rid of scale i recommend Bonide powder systemic. Make sure its the kind meant for edible plants. I'd move the tree to a warmer spot, or use some sort of external heat source to keep the roots warm. Be EXTREMELY careful about potential fire hazards- That cam really make you sad!
     
  20. skeeterbug

    skeeterbug Active Member

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    Emily,
    I do not know what pesticide is in Bonide powder systemic, but I personally, do not like to use systemics on food producing plants. One of the systemics used on citrus (imidacloprid) has a half life of almost 3 years in aerobic soil--not that any of these pesticides is all that toxic, but in general you can control scale with oil spray which is totally safe.

    Skeet
     
  21. Millet

    Millet Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    Scale, is among the easiest insects to control on citrus. I also recommend that you use a good horticultural oil, such as Ultra Fine or Volk. Of the two, I prefer Ultra Fine. Ultra Fine is 100 percent totally non-toxic, therefore very safe to use. Make a solution of 1 percent oil and 99 percent water. Spray both the upper and lower leaf surfaces. Spray in the early morning, or in the evening. You should be able to find both sprays at Home Depot or most any garden center. Myself, I could not see any scale in your pictures, but you should easily be able to identify them if your tree indeed has scale. If you grow citrus over a long period of time, you will frequently notice small scale infestations. Horticultural oils also control aphids, and mealy bugs, which along with scale are the three most common insects you will have to deal with. . - Millet
     
  22. Thistle

    Thistle Member

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    I've used a fine-needle spray of water very successfully to immediately remove scale from my dwarf grapefruit tree. It works faster than soap sprays or oils, and once they're knocked off, I don't think they can climb back on. The tree also seems to appreciate the bath.
     
  23. skeeterbug

    skeeterbug Active Member

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    I did see one scale on the leaf laying on the caluclator (near the bottom, beside the rib).
     
  24. squirrelmaniac

    squirrelmaniac Active Member

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    I like to use Systemic because especially on larger trees, it becomes very difficult to completely eradicate all the bugs, since there are far more "nooks and crannies" I know most bugs can easily be "controlled" but i prefer to completely eliminate them so its not more work later.
     
  25. lawreneb

    lawreneb Member

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    FINALLY, I got some 30-10-10 fertilizer and I put xmas tree lights around the bottom of the pot to raise the temperature of the soil. It seems to have come up in temp a little bit, which is good. Unfortunately, I am afriad my plant is in dire straights. If you look at the pictures I posted on January 3rd of the whole plant and compare it to these, you will see a HUGE difference. SO SAD. I am hoping this fertilizer and heat in the soil works. I also have a humidifier for it and a lamp.

    I looked at this website:

    http://edis.ifas.ufl.edu/CH142

    and I think my leaves look like they have nitrogen deficiency so I hope this fertilizer helps. I should've done this a while ago, but I have been so busy with school and work.... argh!

    Let me know what you think about this rapid leaf loss. Is my pot too big? Should I repot it or do you think this is all driven by the temperature and lack of nitrogen.

    I will work on the scale issue as well, I know see what you are referring too. Right now there arent a lot of leaves with scale because there arent alot of leaves on the tree. Of the ones that fell some had scale and some didnt so not sure if it is my biggest enemy right now or if it is something else, thoughts?

    Thanks for everyone's help.

    Emily
     

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