Ponderosa Lemon

Discussion in 'Citrus' started by rudell, Oct 7, 2008.

  1. Xochipilli

    Xochipilli Member

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    1. Citrus greening is a bacterial plant disease that destroys citrus trees. Better known as yellow dragon
    2. It is spread by infected Asian citrus psyllids, tiny insects no bigger than gnats that feed on citrus leaves and stems.
    3. There is no cure for this deadly plant disease, only prevention by not moving plants and plant material.
     
  2. Futura

    Futura Member

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  3. rudell

    rudell Active Member 10 Years

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  4. Millet

    Millet Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    Basically, a quart and a liter are the same. Your just putting different amounts of fertilizer into the same amount of water. - Millet
     
  5. rudell

    rudell Active Member 10 Years

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    ooops your right...go with 1 tsp ....good luck
     
  6. Futura

    Futura Member

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  7. Futura

    Futura Member

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    or if I go to this ppm calculator and plug in 4 tsp per gallon it says 2,253ppm Yikes!

    http://www.firstrays.com/fertcalc.htm

    I am still working through the ppm calculation stuff so I welcome the opportunity to be schooled in this and for somebody to point out my calculation error.

    That being said, your plant still looks great so what the heck doed this back of the envelope number crunching even matter.
     
  8. rudell

    rudell Active Member 10 Years

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    oh boys...maybe Millet could help you out on this one...
     
  9. Futura

    Futura Member

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    I found this cool bit of information that I found quite helpfull.

    In Gallons, Please!
    Since most home growers use gallon containers and a small teaspoon to dose the fertilizer we can rework the concept to something more relevant than grams and 1,000 liters, after all who mixes 1,000 liters of fertilizer in their basement?

    A US gallon of water contains 128 ounces and with 6 teaspoons per ounce there must be 768 teaspoons per gallon.

    Ideally, we would have the commercial producers provide fertilizing recommendations in "Number of teaspoons (parts) per gallon (768 teaspoons)" directly on the growing instructions, but since this is probably unlikely to happen we need to find a way to compare our "teaspoon-parts" to the industry standard "PPM".

    To do this we must multiply the 768 figure by a constant to make it 1 million. This constant is of course 1,302 (1,000,000 / 768 = 1302 I have rounded off the figures).

    For example, if we dissolve 3 tsp 14-5-14 fertilizer in 1 gallon of water we can calculate the nitrogen strength as follows:

    PPM Nitrogen: 3 tsp x 0.14 %N = 0.42 tsp pure nitrogen x 1,302 (constant) = 547 ppm

    E.g. 3 tsp of 14-5-14 dissolved in 1 gallon of water will produce a 547 ppm nitrogen strength.

    If you wish to prepare a 250 ppm nitrogen solution using Peters 20-20-20:

    Per gallon: 250 / 1302 / 0.20 = 0.96 teaspoons of fertilizer will be required to make a 250 ppm nitrogen solution.

    A 300 ppm nitrogen solution using Miracle Grow 15-30-15:

    Per gallon: 300 / 1302 / 0.15 = 1.54 teaspoons of fertilizer is required.

    Obviously it does not have to be exact. You are allowed to round off for easy mixing (to nearest 1/4 teaspoon for example).

    You do not have to stick with gallons and teaspoons either. If you have an 18 liter tank at home and you are using a 75 ml scoop you can calculate your own personal constant:


    http://www.suite101.com/article.cfm/propagation_seed_starting/105367/2


    So for 24-8-16 fertilizer to get 300ppm you would add (300/1,302/.24=.96) .96 teaspoons per gallon.

    Don't trust my data but I think this is telling us that your one teaspoon per quart may begiving you a 1,200ppm level.

    OK, I'm going to stop now ;)
     
  10. rudell

    rudell Active Member 10 Years

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    ahh is that a good thing....???
     
  11. Futura

    Futura Member

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    I have been told on to aim for a 250-300ppm fertilizing target so 1,200 is high. THat being said let's wait for somebody with more citrus authority to chime in.
     
  12. Millet

    Millet Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    By definition 1 mg per liter equals 1 PPM. (you can calculate from this definition)

    or also

    Although several nutrients (NPK) are available in a fertilizer, it's customary to use PPM of nitrogen as the reference for the dosage concentration when fertilizing plants. In the example that follows, 200 PPM nitrogen will be calculated.

    Step 1. Multiply the percentage of nitrogen in the fertilizer formula by 75.
    Step 2. Divide the result from step 1 into the desired PPM of nitrogen (A 25% nitrogen fertilizer will be used)

    EXAMPLE: Step 1. 75 X .25 = 18.75 PPM Nitrogen
    Step 2. 200 PPM N divided by 18.75 ounces = 10.6 ounces. The 10.6 ounces added into 100 gallons of water is equal to 200 PPM nitrogen.

    To get the amount of fertilizer to add to 1 gallon divide 10.6 ounces by 100.

    10.6 Oz. (296.8 grams) divided by 100 = .106 onces (2.96 grams) per gallon.

    Therefore if you add 3 grams (rounded off) of a 25% nitrogen fertilizer to one gallon you have a 200 PPM solution.

    Millet
     
  13. rudell

    rudell Active Member 10 Years

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    goodness...soooo can someone spell it out for me...my head is spining..am I giving too much ??? I am going with what Miracle Grow suggested for a citrus....can you tell me with my 24-8-16 to add to a quart to aim for 200PPM ???
     
  14. Xochipilli

    Xochipilli Member

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    Your tree is doing great, I grew up surrounded by citrus trees and they were never fertilized. I guess the soil and climate was good for them. My dad still has citrus from seeds and grafted. The only difference is that grafted produces fruit earlier. So, they are big trees, but you can have them on flower pots. Eventually, could be several years; you have to upgrade to a bigger pot, or prune it. Feeding it constantly with fertilizers will take its token. Nitrogen promotes growth and increases biomass production of trees. That is why is recommended mainly for spring. In excess, nitrogen may have adverse effects on the vitality of plants. We don't need growth disorders and mortality of apical buds. "Nitrogenous fertilizers cause changes in the shoot/root ratio. Extra nitrogen supply alters the metabolism of nitrogenous compounds in plants and an increased concentration of amino acids and reduce mycorrhizal induction." I won't fertilize every month. Remember salts do not totally dissolve, they reach a colloidal state. So those roots and what is left of soil, will filter the water, and will retain "unwanted stuff."
     
  15. Xochipilli

    Xochipilli Member

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    Do not use a quart container, use a empty gallon of milk, tap water, one table spoon and wait one day for the Clorox to evaporate, unless you are using running water from a creek:>)
     
  16. rudell

    rudell Active Member 10 Years

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    so what your saying is 1 gallon=4quarts right....so use 1 tablespoon of miracle grow to 1 gallon of my "well" water (no bleach here) with this I don't think I'm close to 200PPM?
     
  17. Futura

    Futura Member

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    I don't know, but trust the packaging instructions and your good results and keep doing what you're doing.

    Sorry to do this to you but it gets even more murky.

    According to Mr. Millet 3.96 grams per US gallon will get you to 200ppm but as you know we live in Canada and we use Canadian (Imperial) gallons which are .83 of a US gallon.

    A teaspoon of granulated sugar weighs around 5 grams, a teaspoon of flour around 3 grams. Grams are a weight measure, teaspoons measure volumes so it is not possible to flip between the two with any degree of precision. Do you have a scale?

    I never pass up the opportunity to pick up a new tool so I will end up buying a scale and fully enter the metric system and use liters as well. I'll keep trying to figure this out and will report back my conclusions.

    I am sure somebody will jump in an answer your question.
     
  18. rudell

    rudell Active Member 10 Years

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    please do...and thanks
     
  19. Millet

    Millet Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    Post withdrawn, impolite post- I apologize . - Millet
     
    Last edited: Jan 24, 2009
  20. Xochipilli

    Xochipilli Member

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  21. Millet

    Millet Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    Rudell, if you add 3.88 grams of 24-8-16 fertilizer to 1-imperial Canadain gallon of water you will have a 300 PPM fertilizer solution. If you use 1-American (US) gallon you would add 4.67 grams of 24-8-16 to obtain 300 PPM. - Millet
     
  22. rudell

    rudell Active Member 10 Years

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    Millet thank you would you fertilize once a month or every two months ???
     
  23. Millet

    Millet Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    Once a month during winter, twice a month during summer. Remember to flush the growth medium 3 times a year with clean clear water. When I was visiting the Citrus Clonal Protection Program (http://ccpp.ucr.edu/) located at the University of California in Riverside, California, they told me that they fertilize all of their container citrus at 300 PPM with every single watering year around. However, they are located in sunny, warm Southern California, and not in Canada. Good luck. - Millet
     
  24. rudell

    rudell Active Member 10 Years

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    god I'm emberrassed to ask this but what is the growth medium?
     
  25. Futura

    Futura Member

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    Either Kreskin or that stuff in your pot.

    On our ungoing fertilizer issues, I looked at the packaging of Miracle-Gro 24-8-16 Water Soluble Plant Food with Micronutrients (Canadian packaging). It said for indoor use 1 teaspoon per imperial gallon.

    If I get my hands on a scale I will find out how many grams to which this converts.
     

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