Hypertufa Raised Beds

Discussion in 'Garden Design and Plant Suggestions' started by Skidmark, Mar 10, 2006.

  1. Skidmark

    Skidmark Member

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    I was just chatting with a concrete finisher and asking about making my 4'x8' 12" high raised beds out of concrete. I used cedar, but after 5 years some of them are rotting pretty badly.

    He suggested that I looking into using hypertufa instead and claimed that they would be very bit a strong and less expensive than straight concrete.

    Does anyone here have any experience with this?

    Thanks!

    Tim.
     
  2. oscar

    oscar Active Member

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    hiya Tim
    i have never made anything from hypertufa, however i have seen it used on old sinks, to make "attractive" (hmmm not sure that it is all that attractive) alpine planters...two things to consider....i would think it would be more expensive to make, not cheaper..and it would probably be less strong then just concrete.........is it the cost of the project that concerns you?.maybe consider building the planters from concrete and cladding the front with stone.

    i just had a quick read here http://www.efildoog-nz.com/hypertufa.htm it says you cant use beach sand as you would in normal concrete, so you would need horticultural sand (washed) meaning extra expence.
     
  3. Skidmark

    Skidmark Member

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    I chatted with my neighbour about it this morning. He built his beds out of concrete and did them 5 1/2" wide and 18" high and felt that they cost him about $25 for the concrete and the steel was scrap that he did not have to pay for.

    Hypertufa looks to be 1 part sand, 1 part cement and 1 part peat moss where concrete is 5 parts sand/gravel and 1 part cement. Clearly less expensive.

    I think I would stick to the hypertufa for planters and such and will do concrete for the beds.
     
  4. chuckrkc

    chuckrkc Active Member

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    I have made hypertufa troughs and planters.

    I use about one part each of perlite, peat moss and cement. I use fiberglass filaments for reinforcement. They are available at specialized building supply centers.

    These are very durable, I think. However, I agree that the cost is probably higher than buying bags of concrete. It isn't as durable as concrete, either. It is lighter, which is something when mixing it with a shovel in a wheelbarrow. Bags of concrete are easily available at any big box home improvement store. You will have to cost of building forms, either way.

    Either is cheaper than hiring a concrete finisher to do it.

    You could also stack Keystone walls, but that can get expensive at $2 each. Tumbled concrete blocks could also look good.

    Chuck
     
  5. oscar

    oscar Active Member

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    forgive me but im a little confused over which you are saying is cheaper oO were talking volume as to percentage, so to make 1 M3 of concrete only requires 1 part cement to 5 parts ballast, whereas the hypertufa mix requires 1 part cement to 2 parts of other mixture = lots more cement 33% cement as apposed to 15% for the regular concrete mix, as the cement would be the greatest expense of the mix, it would therefore be more expensive for a hypertufa mix than regular concrete mix.
     
  6. KarinL

    KarinL Well-Known Member 10 Years

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    First question: cedar rotting out after FIVE years? That's wierd, I think. A bad lot perhaps, or did you use thin planks? For those applications, 4x4 or bigger is best.

    Second, are you going for looks or utility here? Either concrete or hypertufa will be, if you don't mind my saying so, butt-ugly, unless you're fond of a parking lot look. If this is a decorative yard installation, as I'm guessing it is, why not stacked stone? Twelve inches high of wallstone isn't going to cost that much relative to having to build forms, and there will be no need to mortar it. Also, I'm a little addicted to having the freedom to change my mind, and if you ever want to move that raised bed, or if a future owner does, having it built of poured concrete or hypertufa will be a deconstruction and disposal nightmare.

    Another alternative, similar to Oscar's earlier suggestion, might be to use concrete masonry blocks, also unmortared, and face them with decorative stone, or even with cedar planks. That will give you the same old look, but with better longevity, along with perfect flexibility.

    Finally, if money is the driving factor here, the ultimate cheap and not ugly raised bed material is scrap concrete, used like wallstone. Strangely, it looks better than a poured concrete wall, partly because it has more surface interest, and partly because you can grow little ground covers in the cracks.
     
  7. Airfun

    Airfun Member

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    I've never made a wall before, just pots and small things. The mix I use is 1 each cement/sand/perlite/peat moss. I'm using bagged sand at $5.00/50lb bag, you may use gravel as well as sand for a wall, especially if you get sand and gravel in bulk. I think cost wise, peat almost disapears (absorbed into the bulk) so it wouldn't lessen the cost much, perlite would add some bulk, but as another poster mentioned - you would be using a higher ratio of cement to aggregate

    Guessing your project would be about 8 cubic ft if it was 6" thick.
    The amount of work involved would be high, peat is chunky, or at least the stuff I've been using is, I have to crumble it by hand.

    It would sure look nice! Here's a low wall made from 'tufa blocks http://community.webshots.com/album/166815008teCpyl/1

    Good luck! Please reply back with what you decide to do!

    Chris
     
  8. Carol Ja

    Carol Ja Active Member 10 Years

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    Here is a link to a garden with raised beds you might find interesting, http://www.pbase.com/theukoasis/andy_in_swindon.
    To back up what Karen said " might be to use concrete masonry blocks"
    You can decorate with anything like stone, stucco ... Could be done with your hypertufa as well.
    Carol JA
     
  9. Skidmark

    Skidmark Member

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    I'm still leaning toward concrete with about 3 1/2" wide walls. I'm not that concerned about beauty, utility and durability rate more highly, although I really like the hypertufa block wall of Airfun's example.

    The original cedar was 1" thick rough boards 6" wide and 8' long. The five that were here when we moved in 9 years ago are still in fairly good shape, but the five that I built about 6 years ago are starting to rot badly.

    One of our local celebrity gardeners (Brian Minter), used treated landscaping ties lined with polyethylene sheeting, but I don't like the idea of using treated wood in the garden where I grow things to eat.
     
  10. Hoosier

    Hoosier Member

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    Stumbled onto this thread after doing a search for "concrete raised beds" This looks a nice place to visit and join the community. I have been thinking for a couple of years about making concrete encased raised beds. Although I've made some hypertufa pots it never occurred to me to use hypertufa for the raised beds. One thing I hadn't thought about was the flexibility factor and that's a good point to ponder. Concrete beds would be near impossible to move without just destroying them and starting over. That shouldn't be real hard to do except for the shear physical labor of it.

    One other comment was about the ugliness of concrete or hypertufa. Two points to make about, Concrete doesn't have to be ugly, if I'm able to I'll post a pic of some concrete pots that I feel are attractive, durable, and cheap. As for hypertufa, I don't really understand it but it seems to have a broad appeal because of it's "natural" look. I've seen some troughs where moss was cultivated on the surface that would look alright I think.

    The picture is of a concrete pot I made, it's about 4 or 5 gallon capacity and takes one 80lb. bag mix to make. Once a form is made it's fairly easy to attach "mortar joints" to the form and imprint them in the concrete. After the pot is cured painting with a roller colors the high "brick" surface while leaving grooves natural to look like mortar. It would be just as easy to use a similar technique on a wall form for raised beds. Scoring the forms in a random matter could maybe make the finished concrete resemble stone.

    Steve
     

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  11. Skidmark

    Skidmark Member

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    I had a guy who ran a concrete plant tell me that I should make two forms, one 12" x 8' x 4" and one 12" x 4' x 4", but make them such that you have a 2 x4 edge on a sheet of plywood. Lay the plywood flat right where you want the bed to be and fill it with concrete. When it is set, just take the 2 x 4 edges off and stand the wall up.

    Presto, bed where you want it and sides that can (with some difficulty) be moved if need be. What I was not clear on was how to join the sides together.

    He also said that there is no need for metal reinforcing. They have stuff now that looks like fibreglass fluff that you put in as you are mixing and it acts like the rebar.
     
  12. chuckrkc

    chuckrkc Active Member

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    Fiberglass reinforcement is great. You might want to rough up the exterior of the hypertufa or concrete, to make it look more aged. In that case, when using the fiberglass you will need to use a small torch to burn off the ends that likely will stick out.

    There are colors available. Get the dry stuff. It is much easier to use. And cheaper.
     

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